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[IronFist]

I was reading something about how this guy coaches his powerlifters to always explode on the upward portion of the bench press, to try and lift the weight as fast as possible regardless of how heavy the weight is. I can't remember why, maybe it was supposed to train all the muscle fibers to fire at the same time or something.

I've also heard people say the lift should be done slowly to let the muscle "work." I'm not talking about that super slow 45 seconds per rep stuff, but just like a "normal" pace.

So for the last few weeks, when I bench press, I've been "exploding" the weight upward (for every set after the first warmup set). I noticed that the lighter weight sets go up faster, but when the weight is heavy, even though I'm trying to move it as fast as possible, it still goes slowly.

But the reason I'm making this thread is, the first time I did it, it felt funny to try and lift the weight so fast. But in every subsequent workout, the weights have actually been feeling lighter even though I am increasing them each workout.

Just for clarification, I'm only going as fast as I can on the upward portion. I'm still lowering the weight normally, (and honestly, if I tried to quickly lower the weight on bench press, I'd be afraid I wouldn't be able to decelerate it in time and crush my ribcage).

Discuss: the effect on your results that the speed at which the weight is lifted during the concentric part of the movement has. Is it a powerlifting (strength) thing as opposed to a bodybuilding (hypertrophy ) thing?

I was then thinking about applying this same principle to the other big lifts, squat and deadlift.

Squat - I can kinda try to accelerate the weight up quickly from down "in the hole." It feels a little different. I'm not sure exactly what effect this has, however, as I haven't been really focusing on it like I have with bench press.

Deadlift - I was specifically taught not to "explode" the weight upward. I was taught to deliberately use a "slow grind" when deadlifting, to gradually apply more and more tension until the weight begins to move up. Now by "gradually" I mean over the course of about one second; I don't mean I'm taking my sweet time to start the lift. I was told that you can injure yourself if you just try to "jerk" the weight upward all at once with a sudden acceleration when deadlifting, and you can especially get into trouble if you fail on the lift. And then I was taught that the way to achieve maximal tension (and therefore strength) in deadlift is to slowly (over the course of a second or two) apply more and more tension until the weight either comes up or until you realize it's not going to happen.

Discuss - your thoughts on "exploding" the weight upward in squat and in deadlift.

And finally, is there any benefit to "exploding" the weight during the concentric portion of other lifts, such as biceps curls?
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IronFist = ironman from the old AE.

"If you like metal you're my friend" - Manowar

[Samcanadian]

I tried to explode upwards once, and it ended World War 2 in the Pacific.

[elitejp]

I forget where I studied this but evidently its beneficial to have an explosive lift and a controlled negative. If I was to give my own opinion about it I would say it would probably have to do with the amount of force you are exerting when lifting this way. Its harder to get a weight pushed up at a faster speed than it would be slower. So your using greater force which would need more muscles, its like you lifted a heavier weight. As for the negative, well you cant just add weight and then take it off during the contraction part of the movement, so you can just slow the speed to work the muscles more.

Now for experience: When I first started doing the bench this way my pecs were burning like fire that night when i went to bed and alls i did was change up the speed. Nothing else. i think i even ended up using lighter weights that first workout. Now I dont get that effect anymore. SO it could just be because I shocked my body into something it wasnt used to.


There seems to be so many techniques and better ways to lift and gain muscle but for me it really just comes down to lifting heavier weight over time will build mass and strength the quickest.


Oh to answer the squat and DL topic I would recomend not to have an explosive contraction. I would think it would be way to easy to injure yourself.

[zircon]

From personal experience doing powertraining I realised changing training often apart form diet is the biggest help ever.

When starting to train now again I did 1 second up, 4 seconds down. first 4 weeks were fairly light. Then I started for 2 weeks doing fairly heavy weights...3 seconds down 1 second up but all still well controlled and smooth.

Now this week I started powertaining which focusses on the lift...not so much technique. 1-2 sec down and full force up. I will do this for 2 weeks. I use extreme weights (eg 50kg dumbbells for benching) but I can onloy do 3-4 sets 4 reps each. I don't do that much exercise...I don't feel much strained or pumped up after gym, although I can feel it a little bit the following day - not much though.

Ideally if you are into the routine do a 2-3 hypertrphy phase where it's slow down (negatives if possible). Week 1 fairly average weights. 4 sec down 1 sec up. Weeks 2 use heavy weights 2-3 sec down (negatives...u need a spotter all the way through). Week 3 the same except the last 3 days tone it down again on weights, to recover for the power phase.

Then start power phase for 2 weeks, 4 sets, between 4-6 reps (NEVER MORE, even if you can. If you can do more than 6 reps after 4th set you went too light, adjust for next time). Do this for 2 weeks.

Then start again. Keeps your body in flux, and I think hypertrphy breaks down muscle quite a lot under heavy weights..and power training ups your power so you can lift more in general.

A great combo that works for me. In 3 months time I'm def gonna try lift 60's for dumbbell press, weighing only around 80

[professor]

[IronFist]

[professor]

I only got it 6 inches off the ground....last time I checked there wasnt a competition for who could deadlift only 6 inches. It just goes to show the power of the muscles when using the stored energy. I am sure that if most people trained that way for a while they could probably approach or exceed that....provided they did not injure themselves first.
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I feel as though I have spent my life on a island surrounded by monkeys. A Jones.

[Elias]

For someone who wants the best of both worlds, this confuses my training style. I want to be strong, first and foremost, so recruiting more muscle fibres through lifting explosively seems the right thing to do. But I also want larger muscles (secondary aim btw). Come to think of it, I'll go with the strength option...

[IronFist]

Elias, then that raises the question of:

Is it easier (in the future) to make big muscles strong, or to make strong muscles big?

I would assume it's easier to make big muscles strong (since all else being equal, a bigger muscle has more strength potential).

That being said, the neurological adaptation of the powerlifter may give him some advantage... actually, no, I'm gonna stand by my original choice.

So do you guys think it would be easier to go from PLer to BBer, or from BBer to PLer?

I know a lot of the oldschool guys started out as PLers. But in my experience, getting strong (heavy weights, low reps, long rest periods, lower total volume, never training to failure, barely ever getting DOMS, etc.) has always been easier than getting big (high volume, eating, DOMS, eating, muscles screaming in pain, eating, shorter rest periods, eating). But that could just be that my body doesn't want to get big.
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IronFist = ironman from the old AE.

"If you like metal you're my friend" - Manowar

[professor]

I would say...easier to make big muscles strong. Increases in strength is a natural reaction to stimulus. Getting bigger, isnt necessarily. A larger muscle has greater potential than one that is not larger. Getting larger muscles, however, isnt necessarily "natural" in the way that I am thinking. Getting stronger is a survival mechanism whereas getting "bigger" isnt.

The change from BBer to PLer or vice versa, IMO, would be easier to go from BBer to PLer. PL training is very specific...or should be...whereas "BB" training tends to not be. PL training, at least for me, was always easier physically than BB. BB was easier mentally than PL.

(I hope no one else here is as confused by my post as I now am)
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I feel as though I have spent my life on a island surrounded by monkeys. A Jones.

[Samcanadian]

[the_Pupil]

Im gonna keep this simple, no scientific BS.

If your training to build muscle mass then explosive lifting is not what you are looking for. However, if you are trying to get stronger then this is how you want to lift for almost everything. You talked about bench press. If your a BBer the bench press is used to build your chest. If your a powerlifter, strongman, or athlete in general, bench press is done to either increase the amount you can lift on bench or in general increase your strength. Whether you really hit the pecs does not matter. by doing the movements fast you are incorporating more motor units. Im sure there is someone who can explain this in much more detail, but the simple fact is that explosive movement builds more strength......simple as that.

EDIT: forgot to add that one difference in this training is that you general keep the reps below 5 if your a trying to be explosive. When your doing 12 reps you will end up losing speed as you do more reps.
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